>> All right, welcome back from that brief little break. Hopefully, everybody enjoyed those videos.
It looks like a lot of people did. I see people in the chat video saying that she could not stop
watching it. Miss Thompson and Miss Thomas just put a smiley face like, "Oh my gosh!" So yeah,
we definitely, uh, love to have those little small videos to kind of change things up a little bit.
You know, accessibility can sometimes be a little bit daunting for some folks, um, but we look at
it as something worthwhile, and we always want to be able to try to bring smiles to people's faces
when we can. All right, ah, Miss Jet loved it. Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you all.
>> All right, guys, we are going to go into our next panel, um, discussion. We're gonna
have a panel discussion on DHS Outreach to the persons in the disability. So, this should be
very interesting. Um, we actually are going to the moderator change. It's going to be Vania Lockett,
um, who will be the moderator for this particular discussion.
Vania, are you there? Hello, you're there?
>> I am here. Good, good morning, almost afternoon.
>> How are you today?
>> I am well. Thank you for the kind introduction.
>> Definitely, definitely. We are, we are very happy to have you and
the other participants for this panel discussion, um, today. We're actually
looking forward to hearing what you guys are going to be talking about because,
as you know, in this particular community, it's all about sharing information and inclusiveness,
so we're definitely looking forward to seeing what you guys have to talk about. So, I'm going
to actually stop talking because, you know, I will talk and talk and talk and talk, so I will
definitely stop now and hand the reins over to you so you can start with your panel discussion.
>> Thank you very much, uh, and so I'm Vania Lockett, welcome, thank you for joining.
Um, very excited to be able to speak with a number of experts to talk about Outreach to the
disability community. And so I just want to do a quick check and make sure that we have all of our
panelists. I see Sherman Gillums, director for the Office of Disability Integration and Coordination
at FEMA, and do we have Vicki Crawford, senior EEO specialist, Diversity and Inclusion Branch,
Office of Equal Opportunity and Inclusion at Citizenship and Immigration Services. Hi, Vicki.
And, uh, last but not least, Linda Aase from the Office of Civilian
Workforce Management at the U.S Coast Guard. So--
>> I am here. Can you hear me?
>> I can hear you. You can't see me because my camera will not turn on, and I apologize for that.
>> Not to worry, we can hear you. So thank you for joining. Uh, very excited. So let's
get this discussion going. Um, we heard in the last session about, you know, some of
the technical aspects and accessibility, but I'm very excited to approach this topic on Outreach,
uh, in particular. I'm sure many of you are aware of a recent executive order on diversity,
equity, inclusion, and accessibility in the federal workforce. So very exciting
time for outreach as we look to, you know, make sure that we're including everyone,
that we're attracting more individuals, really attracting all individuals into our workforce. And
so as we think through that, I wanted to highlight some of the best practices across the department.
So I'm just going to kick it off with our first question to our panelists and start with, uh,
Sherman. If you will just tell us a little bit about how you got started working in
Outreach to the disability community and what your motivation is for working in this field.
>> Can you hear me? Okay, make sure we can hear me. You can hear me?
>> Yes.
>> Okay, um, I like to frame these conversations with this sort of um, idea about these about the
disability community. There are 61 million people in this country who identify or are regarded as
disabled. That's about the size of the population of Italy if you want to just give it context, uh,
but that's also 61 million ways of living with a disability. So, it all, it seems like a monolith,
there are individual lives that come into this experience. I used to hear this saying all the
time, "Be careful how you treat people with disabilities because if you live long enough,
you'll be one of them." Um, well, I became one of them back in 2002 when I was injured while serving
in Marine Corps. Uh, since then, I've worked in policy related to everything from accessible
air travel, uh, to the U.N. Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities. Although
my motivation came from, um, experiencing what it felt like for someone to lift me up
at my lowest moment. Uh, in most cases, these are people who had experienced a similar, uh,
disability or had a similar experience to me, and, uh, and they were willing to, uh,
I call it jumping back into the hole with me to show me the way they got out, to lead me the way
out, and I wanted to be that for other people. Uh, so I think that's where my motivation came from.
>> Excellent, thank you for that. Thank you for sharing that personal story. And let me turn to
you, uh, Linda. How about you? What sort of got you started, uh, in working with the community?
>> So, thank you for that question. What got me started in my journey is my daughter is a young
adult with a disability, so I've been an advocate for her, and a passionate person. I am a person
with an invisible disability, and to add to what Sherman said, 25% of Americans have an invisible
disability, that's high. I have several invisible disabilities; the most common invisible disability
is depression or mood disorder. I was a support staff to a New Jersey congressman, and I worked
with veterans and people with disabilities. I was a job coach for persons with disabilities,
and I love that job, uh, getting people employed and connecting businesses to natural supports.
I was a former disability program manager at the United States Department of Commerce,
where I built a strong disability program. I am now the Selective Placement Program Coordinator
at the Coast Guard, where I built a program that don't not only recruits but provides outreach
to National Rehab counselors and consumers, listening to the voice of the customer, and
tailoring every session to the audience. I am the founder of the Disability Allies Resource Group
with the United States Coast Guard. I am proud of that group,
and it is the first disability affinity group at the Coast Guard. So thank you, thank you.
>> Thank you, and, uh, Vicki, tell us a little bit about how you got into your role.
I think she's muted. She is -- oh, Vicky, you're muted.
>> She's still --
>> Do you have a mute button in the upper right corner of your screen?
>>
Well, she is figuring it out. It's dawning on me that we can't see
Linda and we can't hear Vicky. These are experiences people have, right?
>> Yes.
>>
Um, so let's, let's keep on moving, and, um, actually, so I, I want, maybe we can just
touch on, uh, Linda, you made an excellent point about, you know, this, uh, invisible disabilities,
and so we're here to talk about outreach. So, um, I, I think that's an excellent point as well,
and just hearing about the numbers of individuals that perhaps could have disabilities is just so
important for us to understand. So tell us a little bit about outreach and, you know,
the outreach and the, I guess, describe one outreach initiative that you've implemented
that you think has had a positive impact. And, uh, with that, what stakeholders did
you need to reach out to in order to make that a success? So I'll go to you first, Sherman.
>> I was actually, uh, reading the chat. Can you repeat the question? I
thought you were going to ask Linda first, sorry.
>> Yeah, that's what I said. I was ready to jump in.
>> Sure.
>> Sure, let him think and I'll, and I'll, we're gonna jump in.
>> Okay.
>> It's all about accommodation, right?
Okay, so what I did at the Department of Commerce when I came and at the Coast Guard
as well was I look at retention and recruitment as outreach. So, put retention first, right?
Put recruitment second, and let's listen to the voice of the customer. What do they need?
What I did through LinkedIn, I've connected now with about 1800 people through LinkedIn, and I use
that as the vehicle to connect with the national Voc Rehab counselors and the targeted disability
groups like The Lighthouse, like the Institute for the Blind. I did outreach to them. I called them.
I contacted them, and I said, "What can I provide to your consumers? How can I help your consumers
get employed?" So to me, outreach is innovative because we always think about recruitment,
but we don't think about reaching out. When I reached out to the Institute for the Blind,
they were like, "You are the first Selective Placement Program Coordinator who has ever reached
out to us. We didn't call you; you called us." And that was significant. So for me, at the Coast
Guard, that's what I've done is outreach. Sherman, um, I guess I'll toss the baton to you. Thank you.
>> Thank you. Well, when I joined FEMA about 10 months ago, back in August, I'm the disability
coordinator under the post-Katrina law that, of course, we all, most of us, probably remember what
happened during that hurricane. And many lives were lost, but the question became, you know,
disasters happen, but if you lose your life after the disaster has come and gone because you have
a disability, that's a different problem. That's not disaster-related. That's a human-made cause.
And so it's my job to look at that. And what I did is, um, after being here almost a year and going
to different disasters, I tried to figure out the problem that we're trying to solve here. Like,
what exactly are we trying to do? The epiphany was, well, we're trying to shorten the time it
takes for people to recover when they have disabilities. That means those incremental
steps along the way that, uh, that, uh, place inequity in the process have to be dealt with,
and that way you enjoy overall success. So what I did is we implemented a risk assessment protocol
where before a disaster or if it's a no-notice disaster, right after, we assess risk based on
the size of the population that's disabled or has identified as having access and functional needs.
Um, and then we do something very important. We immediately get with the Disaster Survivor
Assistance teams. These are the people that go canvas the neighborhoods, but we ask the question,
how much do you know about disability? How do you have those conversations with people
during a crisis about disability? Because what they don't know is that there are a
host of other resources that are available to them provided they identify, and they may not
even identify. It's really about the access and functional need, not a diagnosis or, you know,
what you have in your medical records. What are your needs? How do you access the,
um, you know, the platform where you apply for resources and all the other things? And so we work
with those teams and made it a point to say that the quicker you get to people who are disabled,
and we see that in the numbers of applications as they come in. And so what we've done is we've
set a target right now. It used to hover around 10%, it goes a little bit higher,
but we created a metric where we said we know how well you're doing with disabled populations if
that number is going up relative to all the folks who are applying, a certain number, because we
know how many are in a community should be showing up, and if they're not, you need to adjust your
strategy. And so I think that we're seeing it now in Guam where we're deliberately looking at that
number to indicate whether the canvassing strategy works or not. And if those numbers begin to go up,
we can compare that disaster to disaster, know any trends in the numbers, and I think for me, the
challenge for my staff was not even a month from now, I want that number to go up a week or less
after the disaster. So we're talking about the numbers that apply plus the rate of application.
And even before they set the infrastructure for the shelters and the disaster recovery centers,
I want to see canvassing numbers that reflect you're pulling into people that are least likely
to go to a shelter or a disaster recovery center because of a, a an access or functional need. So I
was very proud of that. It's still being tested. It's going to be tested all hurricane season,
but that's one way we're holding ourselves accountable to a definitive measure of equity.
>> Wow, very impressive. Thanks for sharing. That's wonderful. So I'm liking what I'm hearing.
This is really good, uh, and definitely noting the need for resource sharing. We
don't know what we don't know, right? Is what, as they say, uh, and on both sides,
so it's good that we're capturing metrics to be able to better understand what methods of
communicating information are effective. So we had some conversations earlier this week about
this and about communication and what words we use. So, in the context of recruitment,
thinking through, you know, what's really going to resonate with the audience. And I
think the same applies for disasters. You know, what is going to resonate with the community?
What are the methods that they like to receive information? So these are very, very good points.
Um, I can't see. I don't know if, if Vicki is back with us. I don't hear her or something. All right,
so we'll press on. So, uh, to ask, I guess, on the opposite end, uh, can you tell us about
something that maybe did not work so well? And, uh, you know, in that case, what did
you do? What did you learn from the experience? What would the solution be for that situation?
>> So is that for me? Who wants to jump in?
>> Come on, Sherman, take it.
>> Um, well, I'll start with a big lesson I learned, even as a person with a disability who
came into this role, that when messaging is reactive and when it's too broad,
um, that doesn't recognize the intersubjective experiences that people have. When you hear
terms like accessibility in a context of Emergency Management,
um, people often lump everybody together as if that means one thing. You know,
a mom who has a child with autism is going to see accessibility differently than somebody who,
uh, maybe lives with blindness or lives with anxiety and depression, as I do and Linda does,
and it's just going to be a different type of accessibility. But when the message is so broad
and there's no, there's no recognition that people have to see themselves in the messaging, right?
You have to, you know, American Sign Language did no good in Puerto Rico because a lot of the people
spoke Spanish or if they did do sign language, there are 6,000 sort of dialects, if you will,
of sign language in the world. So recognizing that messaging has to be contextualized within
the experience of people across the spectrum of disabilities, so you have mobility disabilities,
you have sensory disabilities, you have intellectual or developmental
disabilities, you have psycho-emotional disabilities. Taking the time to do that,
um, is important, but it's also just as important to co-create that messaging with people with lived
experience because you can think all day and have a room full of people talking about what
ought to work all day, and you know what happens when companies roll out something they hadn't
talked to certain communities, it's a disaster. Um, part and upon, but in this case, case,
we can engage communities during blue skies when there's no disaster and say what type of message
resonates. And I learned this when I talked to the mom who had a daughter with autism when she talked
about the fact that most accidental drownings are kids with autism. They look at water, and
it's not abstract and formed to them, and so a lot of those drownings happen. But during a hurricane,
that could be really problematic if you have kids that wander off, right? If they're in a shelter
and they wander off and put themselves in danger, how we have messaging that directs attention to
that problem is really about understanding first what the experience is like, and then having the
message reflect, "We understand you, and we see you." And I think it's much more effective when
people see themselves. When it's not effective, the mistakes that I've made is assuming that,
you know, people with disabilities as a monolith, including me, will see the word "accessibility"
and then it'll register and then they'll go make a decision. I'll evacuate or I'll, you know,
take a go-bag. It just doesn't quite work that way. So I was happy to learn that lesson after
watching Florida and, and, um, Hurricane Fiona in Puerto Rico and wondering why people weren't
responding, why weren't people evacuating soon enough, and I think a lot of it had to do with
the fact that they weren't, they weren't part of the messaging that had gone out. So that's
a good lesson, and the way we adjusted, the way what I'm doing now is sitting at the table and,
in some cases, co-creating, and in some cases, transcreating. I mean, I'm going with their
original interpretation and not trying to get in the middle of that to determine when
the next storm hits, what's going to resonate with the community that you represent here.
>> So, um, to answer that question, I'm going to jump in here. First of all,
Janie, thank you for that, uh, comment that you just made, and it was a pleasure helping you,
uh. So, what didn't work so well was your question.
>> And for me, as a person with a disability, and I have several invisible disabilities,
so I have monocular vision, which people wouldn't know, I'm blind in my right eye. I have diabetes,
I have a lower back injury, I have mobility impairment due to two, um, Achilles tendon
surgery and the replacement of my tendon. So, I have several invisible disabilities that I work
with every day. When I came to the Coast Guard, I navigated the reasonable accommodation program,
and everybody understands the process, and it's not perfect, right? So, in orientation,
I was given the name of the disability program manager at the Coast Guard, only to learn through
the process, three months later, that person had actually died five years earlier. So there, I
couldn't find the reasonable accommodation person to help me navigate. So, three months later of
trying to get my accommodation, it was frustrating, to say the least, and that's
why I took those lemons and I made lemonade. That's why I formed the DOG, the Disability Allies
Resource Group, to improve the culture. I'm not a whiner, I'm a doer, and so I created the DOG, and
so now we have a place, and we have a voice, the population of people with disability to improve
what's, what may be broken, right, and to promote people with disability throughout the Coast Guard,
uh. So, the answer to that question is that's what I did to improve the process. Thank you,
thank you, and Kudos, uh, to you, Linda. That's an excellent example, um, so in,
and let me ask a follow-on to that, the Disability Allies Resource Group, is it, uh, DHS-wide?
So, it's, we, it's housed at the Coast Guard, but anybody can join, uh, someone as an auxiliarist,
um, a civilian, military, so our officers, right now I am an officer, I am the President,
I'm actually on a detail right now, so I'm doing this today for the Coast Guard,
but I'm not actually sitting at the Coast Guard for at least six months. Our officers
are mainly military. I am the only civilian, actually, no, actually, I think now we have two,
um, civilian officers, but anybody can join, answer to that question, thank you,
thank you, wow, uh, such an amazing story, it's always good to hear when someone, you know,
takes what could be a negative situation and turns it, flips it into something positive that not only
benefits you but the entire community. So, thank you for that, that's what you get when you have
an advocate, yes, yes. So, speaking of advocacy, tell us, tell me, what would you like to see in
terms of, excuse me, advancements in Outreach, what programs would you like to see, what,
what improvements would you like to see moving forward? Sherman, jump in there, he's ready.
>> Well, I'll just say, you know, Linda, you know, she's probably, she listed all the
various challenges, but she's also got to be, by Nature, an awesome problem solver. That's why it's
important to have people who are good at solving problems, whether incrementally or societally, uh,
at the table because, um, they know how to see the things that are not obvious to get things done.
Um, I think I would like to see more of an emphasis on accessibility and, uh, Universal
Design at the local level. Um, the Americans with Disabilities Act and the Rehabilitation
Act are frameworks that are federally mandated and implemented at the state level. They're not
enforced as much as I'd like to see, um, but besides that, Universal Design goes way beyond
these laws by idealizing a society where everyone enjoys access to what's available, and this has
led to a lot of great innovations that benefit all of us. We have people with disabilities to
thank for voice recognition technology, electric toothbrushes, audio books, typewriters that have
now become the keyboards we use, um, and those environmental control units that we call Siri and
Alexa. I hope I didn't trigger somebody's system at home, but we have people with disabilities and
this idea of making things universally accessible to thank. And so, I think if we keep attention on
this idea that, you know, Universal accessibility is not disabled design, it's not just for people
who happen to benefit from it the most, uh, it's actually beneficial to our entire society. That's,
you know, we see those four letters, uh, d-e-i-a, and all the other ways they talk about it,
it's really about the social contract we have with each other, um, that's long been neglected,
but these are really about opportunities, not handouts or favors or tolerance. I just
think it makes us better when everyone has the opportunity to contribute, like Linda talks about,
um, and they're not excluded based on some aspect of an identity, um, you know, and there is that
loud minority that sees it as a zero-sum game, every parking spot you put there in front of the
store that has a blue sign takes away from me, uh, in many ways, losing sight of the fact that
our economy and our and where we patron guys also adds to the, to the, uh, you know, the vibrance of
the community, the economics of the community. We add to that in many ways, um, and so what really
happens in those cases is the lack of imagination, uh, in terms of how we expand the pie so everybody
gets a piece of it, and, uh, but I think if we consciously do that in some of this outreach,
we'll get better outcomes. It is happening on many fronts, but I'd like to see it happen even more.
>> Thank you, Sherman.
>> They possibly can. Let's think of people first, let's remove barriers, let's do the right thing,
and like Sherman said, Universal Design, I think we can tweak our reasonable accommodation program
and accommodate first, ask questions later. What tools do you need to do your
job? What's the barrier you're facing? Ask those questions. It really isn't that difficult, right?
So, let's do the right thing.
>> Thank you, Linda, and, and just to add to that, what needs to happen for that to change? Is it a
policy change? Is it a legal change that has to happen? What really needs to occur in order to be
able to, you know, make the types of changes that you're talking about? It's not a policy change,
we have policies, we do need improvements and policies that I, from my point of view,
from Linda's point of view, for whatever, whatever that is, and we have to be proactive, we have to
break down silos, we have to have people talk to each other, we have to have the Office of Civil
Rights talk to the Human Resource Office. We're all friends in this, right? We're not enemies, we
all like each other, we can work together, we need to collaborate, and if we think of people first,
not egos or titles, then we're going to do the right thing, and we're gonna provide
the accommodation for the person and give them the tools. How I like to think of that,
it is this way, and the DEIA quotient, think of it as a meal. The D is the invitation, the diversity,
the invitation, Equity, having the res resource to accommodate different abilities to enjoy the meal,
inclusion, us to join and plan the meal, maybe I'm allergic to something and I can't eat that, right?
And accessibility again, remove barriers, intentional inclusion,
create a safe place where few people feel like they belong, listen to what the person has to say,
and being heard to share differences in opinion, you feel safe to bring your whole self to work,
to fully engage, and have a seat at the table and enjoy the meal.
>> I love that, thank you, thank you.
>> I think, um, I'm, I think I'm gonna, I'm gonna steal that, Linda. I'll attribute it to you,
but I think that's an excellent way to give embodiment to what,
you know, that acronym looks like. Um, I, I agree with Linda, I think, you,
the laws are already there and it can't always be about compliance or enforcement
after the fact. Truly about what you do beforehand, uh, that makes it work.
>> One of the things I do with my staff is I embed those expectations in the performance evaluation,
you know, I don't want to make it about messing with their money, but if they're not incentivized
to be proactive, uh, people won't do that by nature in a lot of cases, especially when it's
something that's complicated or seemingly as complicated because it's really not,
as Linda laid out, uh, but but you incentivize it by making it a part of what leadership means
within the context of your organization. If you're a good leader, that means that you have found ways
to make this incorporated, this expectation to a point where you don't even have to call it out,
it just happens. When somebody needs a reasonable accommodation, the process works organically. You
don't have to have an enforcement tool, you know, or a tool that, uh, you know, that's
that's transactional. It's really about how do we truly want this environment to be, uh, productive
for everyone, and if we want Linda to succeed, we need to give her, so that her success becomes our
success, and we benefit from that. Until there's that sort of shared, um, way of looking at it,
it's always going to be seen as a compliance issue when really it should be, it should
lie before that as just, uh, being good human beings, making sure other people have what they
need because we will want that. Amen, Sherman, I love it. So, Gary's asking a good question,
um, he said, uh, the D, the invitation list never includes people with disabilities,
and federal DEIA programs, persons with disability can attend, but only sit on
the perimeter, they're decentered from the table, and feel and from the agenda setting.
>> You want to comment on that, Sherman?
>> Yeah, that happened in a very, uh, glaring way during Hurricane Sandy. You
read the judge's orders, the federal judge, when he outlines the abject failure to consider people,
that was replete within the transcript. She had all these people talking about, "We don't treat
them any differently." So you don't treat a person who's stuck in the mid-rise with the
power out differently from the people that were able to go down the stairs, that's your problem,
you're not getting it right. Equity is equality plus accommodation, right? So if you've just
got equality, but you're leaving out that accommodation part, you don't have equity.
And if you read that judge's aura, it's not very long, I think it's maybe eight or nine pages,
but you could see the quotes from people who just didn't get that you, where you messed up. The
first domino that fell is you didn't have people that you would eventually have to find ways to,
quote-unquote, rescue, um, because they weren't at the table giving you the benefit of how they
would see or envision a way for them to, to escape these, um, in those cases mid-rises that were,
um, it went down because of power and they were isolated for days. Not having them there was the
first mistake before the first raindrop happened. You made the first mistake and they paid for it,
uh, you know, financially the city did, uh, but then the question is, do they learn? So
we need to see more states, more localities not considering, you know, the table a horizontal one
where somebody's at the top deciding who they'll talk to and the distance dictates how important
you are. It's a round table where somebody who you're probably going to not understand, uh,
you don't have a sense of them, but they're going to give you insights into how to be successful. So
the whole population and the experience they have makes you look good and validates your purpose,
you know, as an emergency manager, not just a few people that you could easily, you know, pull out,
um. That was a lot to explain, but I hold Hurricane Sandy and what we learned from
that experience, uh, as a, as a glaring example, um, of what can happen when you
don't have people on the front end co-creating or trans creating, uh, of the expectations.
>> Thank you. I'm seeing lots of comments in the chat, uh, so
someone asked, how can we show management that providing accessibility resources
allows us to build the most productive workforce.
>>
Do you want us to answer that question,
management? Uh, that's, you know, that's hard because it should be self-evident, right,
and if it's not so evident, then that management situation has a bigger problem of a lack of
awareness. Nowadays, there should be nobody unaware, um, even if you're not, you know,
implementing the policies correctly, there's an, there's an awareness that people are
having a harder time because they don't have this accommodation they've been waiting on too long.
Um, and I think in that case, the squeaky wheel has to get the grease, but, uh, but there are,
there are protocols in place to elevate those concerns, and I think you ought to use them, not,
not for you, it's not just about you, it's for people who are not going to feel as empowered to
do that, and you may have to take the, you know, the sort of reputational hit by being the squeaky
wheel, but it's never just about one person, it's about a culture that doesn't see certain people,
and I agree sometimes you have to hit them in the nose, you know, figuratively speaking, to be seen,
so common sense isn't common, right, or everybody would have it, right? Sherman, yeah, and, um, this
is the reason why we formed the affinity group. This is reasons why affinity groups are formed
because management has a big job, right, and they often forget about people with
disability if they're not in their face, and the resources that people need and accessibility,
which is why our group was formed, to raise those concerns with me on ultramat,
to make them aware of it, to provide training and awareness so they understand,
and so that people with disability have a seat at the table and that they're not forgotten about.
>> So, uh, Linda, I have a follow-up to that also because I know that you're,
you've done a lot of work in terms of, you know, accessibility and accommodations. What would you
say, though, about the employees that maybe, um, you know, don't want it to be known that
they have a disability? How do you go about, you know, continuing to foster that concept
of inclusion when you have folks that don't want to be identified as, as having a disability? So,
you can't make a person identify, you can't make a person share that they have a disability,
but if a person needs an accommodation or a change in the way things are done, then they have to ask
for that. And just by asking a supervisor, and I use an example, the EOC guidance shows that people
don't have to say, supervisor, I need a reasonable accommodation. All that person has to say,
and if they're comfortable, and a lot of people don't feel safe, they don't feel comfortable to
share because of reprisal, retaliation, being treated differently, bias, right, unconscious
bias. But if a person comes to a supervisor and says, maybe you noticed I've been coming in late
lately, I just want to share with you, I have to check my blood sugar readings in the morning,
I have diabetes, I have to take medication, and that's the reason why I've been coming in late,
that's asking for an accommodation, that's asking for a change in the way things are typically done.
But again, unless a person identifies if they need an accommodation, then
if you ask, you get. If you don't, um, unless it's an obvious disability that a supervisor sees,
maybe in performance, and they can ask a question if that person needs anything,
not addressing the disability, and then if it comes out through that and the person shares
that they can be accommodated. I hope I answered your question.
>> Yes, thank you. And, uh, I want to pause quickly, I think Vicky,
were you able to join us? Yes, can you hear me? We sure can, excellent, thank you.
Um, so I want to walk back and give you an opportunity to share as well, hopefully,
you've been able to hear some of the conversation, uh, but where do you want to start, uh, Vicky?
>> Um, I want to start with that question number one, okay? Uh, how did I get started in doing the
disability Outreach? So, initially, I started with the, uh, Wounded Warrior program, which really
gave me the beginning of the interest in working with individuals with disabilities. So after about
seven years of that, I moved to the disability employment piece of it, and what motivates
me is that, uh, to give them opportunities as able-bodied people have, and educate them on our
Workforce and what it looks like and how valuable individuals with disabilities can bring a greater
awareness to our employees at USCIS. And also, it helps educate us how to interact and integrate,
engage with individuals with disabilities. So, I have a passion for serving others,
so it came very easy for me to do this, but I think you have to be intentional
in doing it because there's no checklist that you have to check off because there
are things that are going to happen that's not on the checklist. But being intentional
and wanting to engage with the disability community and the disability organizations.
>> Excellent, thank you. Uh, and so we talked a little bit about different ways to communicate,
shared some wonderful best practices in terms of Outreach, you know, how to identify stakeholder
groups. Uh, what are some of the, you know, finer examples, if you will, or, you know,
a shining example that you have? So, I don't know if you have anything like that that you'd like
to share with the group. Um, yes, uh, creating disability partnerships. I always say, create an
effective partnerships, effective partnerships that will lend itself for the organization,
CIS, and for that disability community so that we will get applicants, and in some instances,
they will come in and provide disability awareness training but also expose our managers to the
disability, uh, community so that it doesn't become a one-person shop. Because when you engage
supervisors, they will begin to see these individuals have the skill sets that I'm
looking for and engaging with them gives them a level of being more comfortable and engaging
with individuals with disabilities. So, again, it's a win-win for both sides. And several
organizations that I've worked with have been, uh, the Department of Blind and Vision Impaired,
Vocational Rehab, and Gallaudet University. So, we were always giving back something to them so that
when we come there, they have our name on the map. So, in an example, we do, uh, mock interviews,
um, we redo resume review, so building that effective relationship so when we want to hire,
they know that we're already on the map. But being, again, intentional and engaging
our managers who are really going to do the hiring of those individuals.
>> Oh, thank you. Um, so what would you say has not worked well, uh, and then
what did you learn from that? Um, what has not worked well is sometimes in terms of Outreach,
engaging in an Outreach, and you really haven't done all of the work that's needed so that you
will know exactly what that population is and what it isn't and how you can leverage
the skill sets of those individuals into our Workforce. And so sometimes it's taking
a step back and building that relationship and seeing exactly what do we have to offer them,
because if I show up without ever having any positions, then we're just going there to go
through the motion. But showing that we do have opportunities and we are promoting the
hiring of individuals with disabilities, so that was one of the areas I had to work on.
Thank you. And you said something when we chatted earlier this week, and I think that's, it's come
up again, uh, this morning, about communication, right, and choosing words effectively,
making sure that we're, uh, using words in our, you know, advertising or in invitations,
etc., that really resonate with the community. Do you have anything you want to...? Yeah, and I
think what happens sometimes is when an individual with a disability looks at a resume and you use
those terms like "the best and the brightest," well, those applicants may not feel like, "I'm the
best and brightest," and so they may not apply for the position. So just having very inclusive plain
language that it'll be inclusive for everyone, no matter where he or she fits on the spectrum,
and promoting disability awareness in your communications. If we go to a career fair,
we don't have literature that's, uh, depicting individuals with disabilities, then that's not
lending to us to say we are really intentional about hiring individuals with disabilities.
And taking someone to those, uh, disability organizations that
actually have a disability that can relate to that disability community.
>>
Thank you. So, what would you want to see change, uh, moving forward? What improvements can we make?
>> Um, I think just looking at how we can, uh, affect change from a long-term
perspective and not for the short term, so no matter who is the disability program manager,
those things are in place to continue executing it, and just leveraging things that other agencies
have done that are best practices, that we don't have to continue reinventing the wheel.
>> Thank you, and I see in the chat, uh, someone says, "Awesome, great," uh, "great examples on
intentional deliverage of partnerships." So thank you for highlighting partnership and
the value there, and being able to, uh, you know, oftentimes we have limited resources, right? And
so finding those partners is really critical. So, and we talked a little bit about that as well.
Um, someone had mentioned LinkedIn as a tool for outreach. You just mentioned a few
different organizations. Any other thoughts there in terms of, you know, finding the right partners,
right? So, you know, finding those advocates, those allies that are really going to drive
the change that we're looking to see? Well, I, I think it's important that when we're looking for
these disability organizations, that we, again, we, the EEO office or the HR office, is not just
doing that partnership because, again, we need to do a, uh, more exposure to our hiring managers
for interacting and engaging with individuals with disabilities, which, for us, have been successful
because there have been several managers that have gone to disability, uh, initiatives,
and they engage with those individuals with disabilities, and some of them were hired
because that was direct engagement and not second-line engagement that someone else is
going to the table communicating for the manager, because he or she will be the one that's going to
manage those individuals with disabilities as they will do the able-bodied individuals. So,
I just think it's a collaboration that's needed to be a little bit more, uh,
assertive and just including managers and not just the HR people and the EEO people
because it's a DHS program, and when you trickle it down, it's a USCIS' program.
>> Thank you, thank you. Uh, so I want to turn and see,
do we have any more questions in the chat from our participants or the panelists?
I'm seeing lots of discussion here, but are there any, any last questions that you all have in
the chat? I did see a question from Jane Coyle, thank you. Do you see her question?
>> Do you want me to read it to you?
>> You don't mind, thank you so much.
>> I will. I understand that persons have to complete an RA application, and it's a bit,
so submit supporting medical information before the panel will locate an RA. It can't just be
requesting it from our supervisor. Is that across all components of DHS or just FEMA?
>> And I did answer that question. Every component has a unique directive
that addresses RA and how their process works.
>> Okay, thank you for that, um.
>> So, I, I wonder if that's, you know, something else to talk about, is, uh,
you know, consistency and how we look at some of these, these matters across the board, and maybe
that's, uh, something that could be examined through some of the vehicles that we talked
about earlier for engaging leadership, engaging Council, and so forth into the conversations.
So, what I would love to see, Linda, would love to see, is centralized funding for the entire DHS,
and a centralized directive, so everybody gets on the same page,
everybody's doing the same thing, and we're not confusing people, and accommodate first,
ask questions, you know, after, and let's act in the best interest of our people and accommodate.
>> Um, again, most accommodations now, the new number now is earned or is under 300,
and most accommodations are attitudinal, and you're shaking your head there, my buddy Sherman.
>> Well, I, you know, I'll, I'll, you know, just to add to your comment, um, a lot of folks fixate
on diagnosis and, and things that are about the individual when it's really about the environment,
and that's important for us because a lot of our reasonable accommodation issues are for
individuals who are out in the field at disasters where you won't have the usual Creature Comforts,
you know, the type of chairs you have to sit in, the type of, uh, you know, laptops and all those
things become factors within the context of that environment. And so that's why you have to have
an agile, to Linda's point, this sort of agile system that's consistent, that's predictable,
uh, where people can seamlessly get the request in and not sitting at a disaster or in a situation
for too long without access to everything they would need. Not that everybody has everything,
but in some cases, we're talking about basic aspects of function, not whether a person has
multiple sclerosis or has diabetes. It's about what is that multiple sclerosis and diabetes
do, or how does it impair me in a way that it shouldn't because I can do the job, I just don't
have a chair that I can sit in that doesn't cause pain, or so, and I'll just quickly say,
because in my case, you know, or a laptop where they've got a touch screen instead of a, you know,
where I can't, it's, it's harder to type if I don't have a touch screen, things like that,
they're very contextualized but they have to be dealt with timely or you miss a lot
of productivity. I would, I would probably do an experiment where you amass all the
time it takes for an RA to get approved, how much productivity is lost in that moment in aggregate.
>> Amen, Sherman, amen! You're preaching to the choir, and we're talking about what is your
functional limitation when you talk about what accommodation they need and how quick it should
happen, right? This process doesn't require, um, a thesis or going to the Supreme Court to make a
decision. It's really just human kindness, right? What's your functional limitation,
Vicki? We're, you check in your head. Did you want to say something?
Um, I just think that accommodation becomes more complex than what it has to be
instead of what it should be, um, and I, and that makes it difficult sometimes, I think,
for managers to see their connection and not analyze it, but see what that person needs
the same thing as an able-bodied person needs to achieve his or her job, uh, just that lack
of being maybe comfortable with interacting and engaging on that topic because for some individual
some in managers have never had to interact and engage at that level for a disability,
uh, related issue. So just looking at having that really open transparent conversation and
knowing that he doesn't have the answers or she doesn't have all the answers, but let's sit down
and dialogue, what is it you need to achieve your job the same as Vicki would with an accommodation?
>> So, guys, I gotta jump in. I am sorry, we are actually running over time. I let
it go a little bit longer because this is the type of conversation we need to have. Clearly,
you guys need an hour. This was great because we only had 40 minutes,
and I'm like, wait a minute, this should have been an hour. This is a great thought.
>> No, no, no, no, it's funny, it's fine, it's okay, uh, we do need to stop for now.
>> Um, this was a lot of good information. Um, Miss Linda, I would like for you though,
if you could provide the Disability Allies Resource Group link or more information because
I think everybody really would like to get access to that information. I know I would for sure,
um, and I definitely want to get you guys back next year as a panel, um, because I think you
bring a lot of value to the table with your work experience and the good and the great work that
you guys are doing. So on that note, we do have to stop, unfortunately, we do need to give everybody
a 10-minute break, uh, and then we're gonna go into our next panel discussion. So again, myself,
I want to thank everybody who participated on this panel, this was great, and Miss Vicki,
I'm glad that you were able to make it on, yeah, see you and hear you afterwards.
>> Yeah, I'm glad to be a part of it, and so thanks so much.
>> Yes, indeed, thank you guys, have a good day, great.
Thank you, everybody, thanks, everybody, thank you all. Right, we are going to go into a 10-minute
break now, um, so it's time to watch one of those great little videos, have a 10-minute break,
and then come back, and then we're gonna go into our next discussion about mobile accessibility.
See you on the other side.